Cross Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 ***PRC / TEXAS SPEED UPDATE*** Alright it has become clear that PRC / Texas Speed did not sell a product to CPR that was defective that I then bought. We both agree the Valves are not appropriate for my application and that will be corrected. However the true cause to this issue was not their fault it was actually a result of the Dealer Parts Department. When The LS3 Rockers and LS3 Pedestals were ordered somehow (this is still being looked into but the Dealer has promised to handle all damage) I got the LS3 Pedestals (LS7 Heads have the Pedestals built into the head unlike LS1/6, LS2 and LS3 Heads) but for some reason I got LS7 Rockers. As I had never worked on nor thought about LS7 Rockers I did not know to look for such a failure. Honestly I don't think anyone expected that to be the cause. However when they were compared to LS3 Rockers it became quite clear what the issue was. PRC / Texas Speed has been very helpful since they became involved, while I did not know these were Texas Speed heads I was wrong to fault them in this case. For this mistake I apologize to PRC / Texas Speed. I spoke with Dominic personally to apologize immediately after talking to the dealer so that I could do so directly and not just over the internet. Dominic has been very helpful and I thank him for the way he has handled this issue it speaks very well of the service Texas Speed provides. At this time I am waiting for estimates from Texas Speed on fixing the head situation with the proper setup for my build directly this time. The Machine Shop handling the Short Block has gotten back to me with some good news, only the Piston was damaged and technically it could be fixed but I have asked them to replace it. At this time nothing else was found to be damaged. I hope it stays that way. Thank you to PRC / Texas Speed--------------------------------------------------- So todays the day of the wedding, things haven't been going all that smoothly but hey that's how it normally is according to everyone. So I am taking Tyler to his soccer game this morning, cruising on I-10 in the slow lane just enjoying the day. Then BANG and White Smoke cloud behind me. Car shuts down I coast off the interstate and call a tow truck trying to figure out whats going on.... weird very small coolant trail, coolant level is fine, oil is clear, looks like there is a very very small coolant leak from under the Passenger Fog Light *Scratching head*. Tow company comes out and 100.00 later and some more coolant we are all scratching our heads. Pull the plugs on the drivers side they all have coolant on them. Start pulling the Passenger side to do the same and we decided to pull the intake and suddenly a waterfall of coolant starts coming out of it.... great. Pull the Valve Cover on the Passenger side and we didn't catch the issue right away. Pulled the spark plugs, the front one just dumps coolant.... Pull the intake manifold and we found what you now see in the pictures I have attached... So in closing I am pretty frustrated with my new PRC Heads right now. Hopefully I will hear back from Joe @ CPR as to if they will warranty these. Its clear it was a defect with them the question is did it damage my short block. Now to try and get back in the game for the day and wedding... I really didn't need this today. On a side note this also means there is no way for me to attend the Corvette's on Bondurant event I prepaid for. I am not sure we can get out Money back so if anyone is looking to buy my spot I would really appreciate it. It was for 1 Corvette and both Cheyenne and I driving. ***UPDATE***Alright we had an outside shop take a look at the motor to determine the reason for failure. We sent Texas Speed/PRC the damaged head while the other head was left on the motor as it was installed. (We had only removed the valve cover on that head) The call we got today confirmed that Push Rod length was correct which we already knew on our end but did the due diligence to confirm from an outside source to be fair. They told us that the issue was the intake retainer hits the rocker no matter what the push rod length, its a clearance issue. Since factory LS3 Rockers and Factory Pedestals were used we have determined this is not an install issue. (Both were bought brand new from the dealer for this install not reused) None of the exhaust retainer's had an issue only the intake side on both heads had this issue. We did not install the springs these were a loaded set when purchased. Texas Speed/Dominic has been very prompt in getting in touch with us, they will be speaking with the shop soon. Dominic did confirm that the cam lift was not big enough to be the issue with me over the phone. I want to thank them for that and I hope we get this corrected soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unreal Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Good luck. Getting anything valve train warrantied is hard to near impossible unless 1 place did all the work. Wrong pushrods, shimming valve springs to wrong seat height, wrong springs for cam, etc could all easily cause that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastC3 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 So sorry to hear this ... you were progressing quite nicely ..... will be interesting to hear more as it comes apart .... sounds like you mite have caught it time where no damage is done on the bottom side ;......... as Nick said ... it may become a bit challenging unless you can find something significant in the head itself .....Enjoy the wedding .... and begin again tomorrow .... or maybe even Monday ;.. DAMN!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old yeller Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Did you do the install or CPR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 Heads came fully built from PRC all we did was triple check clearance using Playdoh (I know cheap but effective) get the correct ls3 rockers and the right new push rods then have an ASE Master tech install them with GM factory head gaskets. For now in relaxing watching the ladies do there thing lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extender32 Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Wow! What a way to start off your wedding day. I hope you get back on the road soon and Congrats! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChadC Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 was there any damage to the piston head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unreal Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I don't think he has heads off but I would assume yes. I would check the rods because if the motor was full of water I would expect a bent rod too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Seeing as how you cannot see the remainder of the valve stuck in the portion of the guide that remains in the head, I would agree with unreal that valve face contact with the crown of the piston is imminent. Ugh, that sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desertdawg Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Sorry to see this, hope it's not to serious inside.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChadC Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Seeing as how you cannot see the remainder of the valve stuck in the portion of the guide that remains in the head, I would agree with unreal that valve face contact with the crown of the piston is imminent. Ugh, that sucks.if thats the case (i thought as much too) that means a new engine. ..yes yes, I know one can rebuild it. but with the prices of LS3 one could get a 376ci 430HP BONE STOCK ,complete engine for $6,500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDAGRUV Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 What a BUMMER!!!!!!!And for it to happen on your wedding day - that CAN NOT help the stress level any!!! Keep us posted and let us know if there's any way we can be of help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Heads came fully built from PRC all we did was triple check clearance using Playdoh (I know cheap but effective) get the correct ls3 rockers and the right new push rods then have an ASE Master tech install them with GM factory head gaskets. For now in relaxing watching the ladies do there thing lol When piston-to-valve clearance was checked, was coil bind checked? And if so, were solid lifters used for checking? A hydraulic lifter should never be used to check PTV clearance and coil bind, unless it has had its plunger welded so it cannot collapse. The brinelling on the spring seat makes me think there was a clearance issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Wrong pushrods could also do it, by causing the rocker to side-load the stem, but man they would have had to have been waaaayyyyy out of whack to cause this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Ok here are the rest of the pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Are there any signs of pistons kissing the valves on the other cylinders? I really cannot tell from the pics, but I do not see anything resembling contact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 No nothing on the other 3 I did not take it any further apart. (Meaning the other cylinder head is still on) All the others are clear its just this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Is the engine in a state where you would be able to bar it over by hand with a breaker bar and a socket on the crank, or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 I could do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Fangs Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Pull the intake and exhaust rockers off of a cylinder on the side that is still assembled and mark the valve stem tops liberally with a sharpie. Re-install the rockers, torque to spec and rotate the engine 6-8 times. Pull the rockers back off and see where the rockers are riding on the valve stems. This will tell you if side loading could be a cause for the failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Ok I will do that well John will have to were still getting ready to leave and I already can't find certain small items like the Camera's Memory Card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dale68z Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I was expecting a wrist pin with no piston and an oil pan full of crunchy stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cross Posted October 21, 2013 Author Share Posted October 21, 2013 Alright guy's I will be gone Monday-Friday (Honeymoon Cruise) although I will be making phone calls when I can. When I get back Friday I will let everyone know what has happened so far, I have John staying behind to work on things while I am gone but I don't know what to expect yet. Thanks again for the thoughts, insight and conversation. See you guys in a week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastC3 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Have fun ..... and congrats !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve@LPM Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Damn that sucks. Never seen a failure like that where the guide broke as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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