High speed cruising.

[BSeery]

I am going to try my very, very best to keep this from sounding like, or turning into a rant. It may not happen so don't be offended in anyway if you don't like where this goes. This was not meant to say anyone is doing right or wrong or anything like that -- do what you want, this is just my take on things.

Organized Corvette Cruises and High Speed Runs.

I am out.

I will not be doing the 100+ runs down a 2 lane road while passing people in a no-passing zone. I won't be doing triple digits for 10 miles at a time or cruising at a minimum of 95 MPH to an event. Not going to do this anymore.

There are many reasons, one of which is my car is not built for this. When my 1980 was built it was designed to run at the 55 MPH federal speed limit and top out at 85 MPH. It wasn't made like the C4-C5-C6 generation and it's hard to do this all day long. For me it's not a comfortable to drive really high speeds all day long.

Now don't get me wrong -- I speed. Occasionally I even haul some ass. Anytime you want to go out to Firebird and run them on the road I am more than game to show you how my C3 will run with the C5's. However this is only for the 10 minute races they hold in a safe place with no surprises such as traffic, animals and police officers. I do also run about 5-10 MPH over the posted speed limit. That is speeding. I will run 80 MPH down the interstate on a cruise, but don't expect much more than that.

To me, not only are the 100 - 150 MPH runs dangerous to my car, my passengers, my fellow cruisers and my self, I just don't find them 'enjoyable'. I want to be able to look at the scenery, relax and enjoy the sun in my face and the wind in my hair without the stress of keeping my car in line at speeds that would give me a felony ticket. Some pick on "Doc" for only doing 80 ish the whole way to San Diego, but I am starting to see why he is that way. Yeah I most likely will blip the car up to 100+ out in the middle of nowhere that is the long interstates of Arizona, just don't expect me to do it for very long or very far. Those little blasts are just as fun and enjoyable as the scenery and the nice ride. I just don't see the sense in doing them the whole way there or while in areas that are not safe.

So, like I said this is not a rant. I don't want anyone to feel that they can't do what they want on a cruise. You want to go out front and run each other at 140 ish -- go for it !! Have some fun! Your cars are made for that and that is your thing - do it.

Here is where I do have to put in a bit of a rant.

If you are going to do the high speed runs and what not, please -- PLEASE be safe. Also.......

Bring directions to where we are going.

Those of us that went on the Chino Valley cruise saw this come to a head a few times. There would be a stack of Corvettes at an intersection with no one knowing where we are going. Not only do we all to look stupid, but it's a bit dangerous to be diving from one lane to another as the one person who knows the way finally shows up and gives some direction. I personally thought the whole thing was hysterically funny. But then I realized it was not safe and was not fair for the other people in the cruise.

So, I will no longer be leading the way, taking the point, or be the front man. Yes, I will still be the Corvette Forum's Arizona Events Coordinator as long as people want me to. When that day is done I will easily give it to someone else. I will continue to run Arizona Vette Net. I will even help organize some cruises of my own and help you set up events if you have never done so before. Just don't expect me to run 140 MPH to stay with you all so you can know where we are going.

On all events listed on Arizona Vette Net we will list the address of where we are going. If I get ambitious I will give a map of the location. Sometimes I may even post directions. If you are hosting an event please make sure to list your address and directions. It will be YOUR responsibility to take that address and use www.mapquest.com or http://maps.yahoo.com to get directions. If you don't have directions, then when we get to the start / meeting point please ask for directions and right them down. Make sure that everyone in the cruise agrees upon the route and sets up some "stops" along the way to let everyone catch back up.

This way everyone who wants to cruise at 65 MPH can do so. We will ALL know where we are going, where the stops are and where we are at. This way the others who want to test the limits of their cars can do so at their will and the others won't have to fight to stay with. This way we won't have to pull over to the side of the road after each traffic light and then dangerously all pull back into traffic. We know where the next stop is, and we are all adults. We should know how to get to the next stop on our own and we will catch back up after the light turns green and we get to where we are going.

If and when everyone knows where we are going and how to get there, I think, we will ALL be able to enjoy the ride and worry less about who is leading, who is left behind and are we supposed to turn right or left on 89-A.

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If anyone has any comments please feel free to post them here. If you don't like what I've said (and I said this was not meant to offend or even change anyone's driving) post them here as well. If you REALLY don't like me now and think I just suck -- well, send me a private message. ;)

Hope to see ALL of you on the many upcoming cruises and events to come. And remember, it's not just the destination -- it's the journey that makes it all worth while. So, enjoy the ride.

[Eddie44]

I for one would like to applaude what Bryan has said here! :

I will go on record as admitting that I have probably been one of the major offenders. Will I quit driving over the speed limit, no. I'm not going to admit something that you all know is a lie. I will go on record here and now as saying I will be doing what I can to slow down and I mean dramatically. I of all you folks should know better.

I consider each and everyone of you a friend and we've been on a road to doom for some time now. A number of us go on cruises with and without our significant others. I don't want to be the one that has to explain to them what happened when we lost control of the situation (be it our faults or some innocent persons fault).

As most of you know from my posts, I just returned from a 5K mi plus "cruise". I can honestly say I may have broken triple digits once or twice and that was passing in a safe passing zone. I have never enjoyed a cruise more. We enjoyed it because we started as a group and every evening ended as a group at one location. We didn't necessarily stay together which would be impossible with 4,000 plus cars. But for the most part we ended at one venue and spent time bs'ing with each other about the days drive and meeting new people and admiring each other's cars.

As aggravating as it can be getting somewhere I would suggest we schedule stops on the cruise route, again so all can catch up.

Don't expect me to be doing the speed limit all the way as I don't normally drive that way but expect me to be within 10-15 mph of that limit. Will I never break triple digits again, no! It will however be in very controlled circumstances and on a very limited basis.

I sincerely hope we don't loose any members over this but my gut says we will gain membership by making this commitment. I believe we have scarred some people away by what I'm sure they saw as ridiculously juvenile behavior. I know of one person we don't see nearly as often as we might if our behavior changes.

Again, I would like to applaude Bryan and thank him for bringing some long needed sanity to this group.

[Togo]

OK - my turn?

i understand where you are coming from - and can respect your decision - however, i may disagree with eddies comment

I sincerely hope we don't loose any members over this but my gut says we will gain membership by making this commitment. I believe we have scarred some people away by what I'm sure they saw as ridiculously juvenile behavior.

[Eddie44]

I would not and will not criticize anyone who wants to "get out and stretch their legs" a little. I'm only saying I will be way way more cautious when I do it.

Chris, I have personally heard more than one regular member of our group complain and for that matter not attend some events because the people who have committed were the "racers".

Again, I'm not condemning anyone for their behavior. I've been one of the bigger offenders. All I'm saying is I agree with Bryan and will be doing what I can to change my behavior.

If we schedule stops along our route folks won't get lost and those that want to do some spirited driving can do that.

[Togo]

I would not and will not criticize anyone who wants to "get out and stretch their legs" a little. I'm only saying I will be way way more cautious when I do it.

Chris, I have personally heard more than one regular member of our group complain and for that matter not attend some events because the people who have committed were the "racers".

Again, I'm not condemning anyone for their behavior. I've been one of the bigger offenders. All I'm saying is I agree with Bryan and will be doing what I can to change my behavior.

If we schedule stops along our route folks won't get lost and those that want to do some spirited driving can do that.

[Guest XLR8TNC5]

Okky dokky, guess its my turn to give my opinion on this.

Firstly,

as far as changing my behavior - i can't even say i'd like to try - i enjoy driving my car the way it was built to drive - and for that i'm not ashamed - and as long as there's a front runner group to run with, i will do my best to keep up with them, now, if the front runner group gives up their "wicked ways" then i'll follow suit - but i don't see this happening.

[Desertdawg]

: OMG!!! What a bunch of brown nosing pansies!!!!

[Desertdawg]

Just kidding.... :

I do agree that sometimes it seems we are in a death race....

Please keep common sense in mind when you mash the go fast pedal...

[Eddie44]

:  OMG!!!  What a bunch of brown nosing pansies!!!!

Hey at least we show up on the cruises! Wasn't the last time we saw you when we came down to GB? Aren't you supposed to be working? :

You get high speed and you even start posting pretty little pictures huh?

[BSeery]

You get high speed and you even start posting pretty little pictures huh?

[Desertdawg]

I always posted pictures, pretty or not, it just took alot longer to find them...

Sorry I haven't been making it to the cruises lately, work sucks, and I still have a family to be with... Both me and Jammye agree, after Sam leaves for college, we will have a lot more free (adult) time. So give us another year. :

We will still be broke though. Damn college bills

[Togo]

Both me and Jammye agree, after Sam leaves for college, we will have a lot more free (adult) time

[ICULUKN]

Anyway, I know I am the BIGGEST offender of the triple digit club. So I will not ruin the fun for others. I will not be attending the cruises for the better of the group and its membership opportunities. I will however meet you all at the final destination at a predetermined time. Please do not flame me for dropping out of the cruises as I will still attend the event. I am taking the high road and dont want to hurt the club with my aggressive driving style. :

The last thing I want to do is split the group. We are ACE.. not 'front runner ace' and 'backpacker ace'. If we all cant agree, (or at least condone) our actions, then what is the point of being a club.

Bryan if you are pissed because of the groups lack of planning and being unprepared, that is one thing... Just because you found Jesus... doesnt mean the rest of us did....If you want to slow down that is your decision. Your insurance company will thank you.

I will be taking my own direction for now on. Sorry for being a bother.

[BSeery]

Anyway, I know I am the BIGGEST offender of the triple digit club. So I will not ruin the fun for others. I will not be attending the cruises for the better of the group and its membership opportunities. I will however meet you all at the final destination at a predetermined time. Please do not flame me for dropping out of the cruises as I will still attend the event. I am taking the high road and dont want to hurt the club with my aggressive driving style.

[Eddie44]

Glenn please reread the posts above. I don't believe anyone is "at fault" here. I have been a major offender and am not blaming, comdemning or otherwise flaming anyone. We are all adults and make our own decisions. I have just come to the realization that I (and I only) was acting foolish at times. I know there are folks that will continue spirited driving and I say go for it! I will find it hard not to but I am committed to not doing it nearly as much and for short sprints if it does.

As I said above, I had a great time on the HRPT and it didn't involve such spirited driving. I saw alot of countryside, met alot of great people and had a ton of fun.

Don't put a damper on what has and will continue to be a great bunch of friends by taking he brunt of these posts upon yourself. I can only speak for myself but I don't point fingers at anyone. As I said above, we're all adults and are responsible only for ourselves.

[ICULUKN]

we are all adults.. that is true... but I know I am the one who starts the ACE 500 (most of the time). I dont want to be looked upon negatively if this is the direction that the majority of the club wants to take.

[Eddie44]

we are all adults.. that is true... but I know I am the one who starts the ACE 500 (most of the time). I dont want to be looked upon negatively if this is the direction that the majority of the club wants to take.

I think that's exactly the point I have been trying to make is I'm not going to look negatively upon anyone. You and probably 4 or 5 others can continue to run the ACE 500 if you like and I'll applaude your right to make that choice. I happen to have made a different choice. As they say, to each their own. I've said I will be doing it, but on much, much rarer occassion and for shorter distances. It boils down to I'm going to behave most of the time and I don't blame or condemn anyone for the decisions you or they make.

I've never belonged to a "Vette club" and don't intend to at this point in my life. I've heard too much negative about the bickering and in-fighting. I don't want ACE to get that reputation or we all might as well go off and join the others in those clubs.

Another point I would make is fast or slow I would like to see everyone just accept the other persons decision and let's get back to what brought us all together and that's friendships with good people of similar interests and the Vette.

The last thing I'd add is don't expect us to quit ribbing you about your aggressive style of driving. You wouldn't be the Glenn we all know and love without it. My Dad always told me, "I tease you because I like you. If I didn't like you I wouldn't talk to you at all". I'v always practiced that philosophy.

[1EvilC5]

I missed the last cruise and will being staying up in Boston until July 2nd and look what happens.

From what I have read, it sounds like some members want to keep thier driving in check, and that is not a problem.

I say drive your car to your enjoyment and satisfaction, just remember you have to live with your actions so keep those in mind.

Long live A.C.E. :

Phil...

[Guest XLR8TNC5]

Glenn,

Don't you dare make yourself the martyr in this situation. I plan to still run aggressively when we are on a cruise, but I think the idea of a front runner and a backpack group with a few stops along the way to let people catch up is a GREAT idea. This way, you, me, Phil, Tony, Dan, Chris, Mark, and whomever the more speed limit challenged people are can still have our cake and eat it too.

Please don't take this to mean you are the ONE person who instigates and offends. Okay, you are the fastest one, but you are not the only one. We are all adults and that is why I think it is awesome to have a choice on the cruises now. This way everyone is happy. The ones who choose not to run with you can stay behind. It really isnt a big deal. And have you EVER known me not to try to be at the front with the "boys" lol. Im just saying in my thread above, that even though I like to have fun and go all out on the runs, I still try to stop and wait for everyone to catch up. It isn't a big deal to me to have to pull over and wait for them to catch up to us. I enjoy it actually. This way, Ican let the adrenaline settle for a few minutes, thenI clear my head, get back out there and do it again. lol.

So, lets not make this personal or I will personally kick your Ass. And Im not talking about in my car.....I really really enjoy running with you and your style of driving makes for a blast of a cruise. So, don't leave the rest of us "speed demons" hanging out to dry. That would just suck ass.

[knkayotte]

Couple of quick comments,

It was inevitable this was going to be brought up. I do believe we lose more members then gain, except for the core group, we do not get allot of repeat customers. There has to be a reason for this.

I didn't say anything at the cruise last week, but some of the people that were passed on the Jerome hill by the lead group were pissed off. I could see their faces once they pulled over and let us by. I was embarrassed to drive by them, looked bad for all Vette drivers not to mention the club. Not to mention I saw some dumb ass passes in very bad blind spots. On several occasions, I saw cars go onto the shoulder to let Vette?s go by.

Having said that, the little time I do hangout with this group, I always have a blast. Even if we are just sitting around shooting the shit. As most, I love a spirited run from time to time, but there is a place and time.

That is all.

[ICULUKN]

Tanya,

My intention is not to be the martyr in this situation. I dont want my enjoyment to be at the expense of my closest friends. If the few of us that front run make the 'cruise' unenjoyable for other participants, then why would the slower crowd want us to come. I for one like to invited because I am liked; not attend just because I am part of the group.

ACE is evolving, and I am not sure I like where its going. I will still attend the shows ect and events. The good thing about ACE is that you can pick and choose what you like to do. If you like to cruise... you show up and cruise. If you like to show.. you show up and show... I like to race... if the group no longer condones that then I would rather drop the cruise than be looked down upon for my actions. I dont 'cruise' anywhere. I am in it for the road. Some people go to Jerome for the weather, some go for the trees.... I go for the twisties.

[Togo]

this thread is taking a direction i'm sure bryan never intended it to. and that is sad. we are a pretty tight knit group, like has been mentioned before - teh same 10 or so people keep showing up for ALL the gatherings - we all have a blast - both during the driving experience AND at the final destination no doubt.

the thing for ME that makes the driving fun is the speed - i'm not a scenery guy myself, never have been, probably neer will be either!

i think Glenn is right - the group IS evolving, but we as the active members need to evolve with it and be able to adapt - that is why i think if we have 2 "teams" driving to our destinations, those that choose not to front run don't have to feel pressuerd to drive near triple digit speeds! this will keep both style drivers happy.

now i brought this up to glenn last night on the phone and he sees it as a bad idea to divide up the group - i for one don't see it as dividing, i see it as catering to both sides of the group - so let's not be hasty GLENN - you know some of us truly enjoy running at the front of the pack - and i am sure that as eddie pointed out, there are those that will be in our back packers group that may come up front and play with us from time to tmie - and that will be THEIR choice!

so stop looking at this as a personal attack on YOU and let's try to find a feasible solution for all to keep enjoying the things that have made this group what it is - GREAT!

[Eddie44]

I too don't see this as a "splitting" of the group. I think several of us have just publicly stated our positions and nothing should change on cruises. I just didn't want people say "what the hell is wrong with Eddie, how come he never plays anymore?". I will still attend functions and have just as much fun as I have ever had. You guys can go off just as you always have and play but my time doing so will be limited. I will applaud you if you do so. On the other hand, I will be disappointed if you take this thread has some kinda of personal attack and either leave the group or hold some kind of grudge against those of us that don't play as often as we used to.

In the immortal words of the famous philosopher Rodney King "why can't we all just get along?"

[ICULUKN]

The way you all are talking... its like this post was never created. We always had a front runner group, and we never pressured anyone to do anything that they didnt want to. We are adults, and no one should be bullied into a situation of driving at speeds that the driver is not comfortable with.

I think Chris, Tanya, and Eddie are loosing the original intent of this thread. The purpose was to point out that we (Tanya, Dan, and I) were driving like idiots from Jerome and Bryan is not going to participate in our high speed activities by being the front runner to our destination when the rest of us do not know our way.

Do you really think Bryan would have spent all that time typing his thoughts if he didnt want to see a change?

I really dont think its going to change much if I dont go on the 'cruise' part of the event. Tanya and Dan can still front run. I'll just meet you there. I really dont want to make anyone mad with my driving... and we can still all "get along"

[Togo]

I really dont think its going to change much if I dont go on the 'cruise' part of the event. Tanya and Dan can still front run. I'll just meet you there. I really dont want to make anyone mad with my driving... and we can still all "get along"