Tell tale sign that the clucth is failing????????

[Togo]

This is my first "fast car" (some of you would argue i'm sure)

and my first hi performance clutch that i actually have some seat time behind.

several weeks ago while downshifting on the freeway, i noticed that the RPMs just went nuts and the car didn't go anywhere - i let off and it caught (i was thinking it was slipping due to my bald tires)

it happened again today on the way home from hooters.

so i paid attention to my DIC and there were no traction issues, so my first thought is that the clutch is giving way.

it doesn't do it all the time - just in the "powerband" when downshifting and getting on the throttle.

it doesn't do it at startup, but i'm sure a few of you have heard me clamor about clutch chatter on my car

the chatter isn't even as bad now, so i'm a bit worried - any tell tale signs?

any ways to test besides what i'm doing?

for the record it's a Spec III - i'm sure some of you preach these things, and you have your reasons, but with only 5000 miles and half a dozen drag launches and 2 "burnouts" at the strip - this clutch has seen nowhere near what i think it's useful life should be (unless i'm sadly mistaken!)

so....do tell!

[AZJoeD]

Seems to me that if it was the clutch slipping, you would notice it during acceleration and off the line. You mention that it happens when you downshift and power up. Are you sure that the trans is going in gear solid (synchro problem?)?

When you downshift your "Rs" will go up, but souldn't go nuts. Are you losing power? Or is the tach just indicating high "Rs" but power is there?

[Guest AZ Power & Sound]

This is my first "fast car" (some of you would argue i'm sure)

and my first hi performance clutch that i actually have some seat time behind.

several weeks ago while downshifting on the freeway, i noticed that the RPMs just went nuts and the car didn't go anywhere - i let off and it caught (i was thinking it was slipping due to my bald tires)

it happened again today on the way home from hooters.

so i paid attention to my DIC and there were no traction issues, so my first thought is that the clutch is giving way.

it doesn't do it all the time - just in the "powerband" when downshifting and getting on the throttle.

it doesn't do it at startup, but i'm sure a few of you have heard me clamor about clutch chatter on my car

the chatter isn't even as bad now, so i'm a bit worried - any tell tale signs?

any ways to test besides what i'm doing?

for the record it's a Spec III - i'm sure some of you preach these things, and you have your reasons, but with only 5000 miles and half a dozen drag launches and 2 "burnouts" at the strip - this clutch has seen nowhere near what i think it's useful life should be (unless i'm sadly mistaken!)

so....do tell!

If you only have 5,000 miles, im guessing the disc itself is fine... either the pressure plate cant take the power of your engine, or your hydraulics might be on their way out. 99s are notorious for having slave and master failures so there might be some answers there as well. I have also seen on a couple cars where the rear main leaks onto the clutch making it slip.

Hard to say without pulling it apart, but maybe put it on jacks and pull the access panel to your clutch and peak at it with a flashlight... look for an abundance of clutch dust, any pieces of the disc floating around, or anything out of place.

did you buy a new flywheel with the clutch? If not, thats pretty much guarenteed to be your issue... Spec discs are NOT made to be used with a machined flywheel as they are made thin for performance purposes... if you reused your flywheel they typically take .015-.030 off the flywheel, and sometimes more if required, and GM flywheels are not supposed to be machined per GM... that being said 5-7,000 miles is about right for having a reused flywheel and putting a new one on will help, however since the disc is already seated to your current flywheel, chances are it will chatter like crazy and never properly seat with just replacing the flywheel with a new one. If you have a new flywheel and clutch, then 15,000-20,000 is normal for a spec clutch, but a lot depends on driving habits.

[ChadC]

offering that info right there Mike is why you will always get my business.

thanks

chad

[Togo]

i can't answer the questions as far as new flywheel, or hydraulics or anything, but i'm sure that the guy i bought the car from didn't skimp when it came to the car - i'm thinking he put the Z06 slave cylinder, and i would assume that the guys at MTI informed him about the flywheel thingy!

i guess i'll have to have ya take a look at it mike -

i have heard several arguments both for and against the spec clutch, so i'm torn, if it's bad, should a new one be put in? or should a different brand be put in?

what is the warranty of spec? if there is an issue with the clutch itself, might they stand behind their warranty?

just curious -

i do find it odd that there is NO slip at WOT from a stand still - i just don't understand how at a 55MPH roll, it slips as bad as it does!?!?!

[Guest AZ Power & Sound]

i can't answer the questions as far as new flywheel, or hydraulics or anything, but i'm sure that the guy i bought the car from didn't skimp when it came to the car - i'm thinking he put the Z06 slave cylinder, and i would assume that the guys at MTI informed him about the flywheel thingy!

i guess i'll have to have ya take a look at it mike -

i have heard several arguments both for and against the spec clutch, so i'm torn, if it's bad, should a new one be put in? or should a different brand be put in?

what is the warranty of spec? if there is an issue with the clutch itself, might they stand behind their warranty?

just curious -

i do find it odd that there is NO slip at WOT from a stand still - i just don't understand how at a 55MPH roll, it slips as bad as it does!?!?!

The hardest thing about the flywheel is a lot of shops dont force customers to purchase them, while we do for reasons just like this... I have personally installed over 200 Spec clutches with no failures as long as everything was done right, however the few times there were issues, it was EXACTLY the same thing you are claiming and it was either due to one of the following... either the flywheel wasnt new or from a company other then Spec, or they used the slave spacer when they werent supposed to which wont allow the pressure plate to fully disengage... even with heavy abuse I always get a good 14-15K miles out of the Specs in my car.

For the price there really isnt a solid alternative UNLESS you dont plan on going to the track much or using nitrous, in which case the LS7 clutch is a pretty good bargin... the best clutches out there of course are the Spec dual disc, RPS twin and Exedy twin, all of which are $2,000 and more... for the price range of the Spec single discs I cant really recommend anything better. What you might try to do is take a drive in Drews vette (drewstein on here) as he has a spec stage 5 in his now, and had a Spec stage III+ before and see what he thinks. Im a firm believer in the Spec stage III+ as it has great drivability and being an iron disc typically wont overheat.

All in all clutch gremlins can be difficult to chase down because there are so many variables, and without receipts to really show what was done when, a lot is a guess... the most difficult part being the labor involved with the clutch removal which pretty much means we tell you to buy everything at once to assure it doesnt have to come out again!

If possible contact MTI or call the previous owner to see if he for sure bought a new master, slave, clutch and flywheel, and get a receipt for it... Spec generally does not cover anything other then manufacturer defects, but any time ive personally come to them with a true issue they havent denied us.

[Togo]

a'ight, i'll dig throughthe papers and see what i have - i'm sure there's gotta be something in there!

i'll report back as soon as i hear something!

thnaks for the info mike!!!!

i can't answer the questions as far as new flywheel, or hydraulics or anything, but i'm sure that the guy i bought the car from didn't skimp when it came to the car - i'm thinking he put the Z06 slave cylinder, and i would assume that the guys at MTI informed him about the flywheel thingy!

i guess i'll have to have ya take a look at it mike -

i have heard several arguments both for and against the spec clutch, so i'm torn, if it's bad, should a new one be put in? or should a different brand be put in?

what is the warranty of spec? if there is an issue with the clutch itself, might they stand behind their warranty?

just curious -

i do find it odd that there is NO slip at WOT from a stand still - i just don't understand how at a 55MPH roll, it slips as bad as it does!?!?!

The hardest thing about the flywheel is a lot of shops dont force customers to purchase them, while we do for reasons just like this... I have personally installed over 200 Spec clutches with no failures as long as everything was done right, however the few times there were issues, it was EXACTLY the same thing you are claiming and it was either due to one of the following... either the flywheel wasnt new or from a company other then Spec, or they used the slave spacer when they werent supposed to which wont allow the pressure plate to fully disengage... even with heavy abuse I always get a good 14-15K miles out of the Specs in my car.

For the price there really isnt a solid alternative UNLESS you dont plan on going to the track much or using nitrous, in which case the LS7 clutch is a pretty good bargin... the best clutches out there of course are the Spec dual disc, RPS twin and Exedy twin, all of which are $2,000 and more... for the price range of the Spec single discs I cant really recommend anything better. What you might try to do is take a drive in Drews vette (drewstein on here) as he has a spec stage 5 in his now, and had a Spec stage III+ before and see what he thinks. Im a firm believer in the Spec stage III+ as it has great drivability and being an iron disc typically wont overheat.

All in all clutch gremlins can be difficult to chase down because there are so many variables, and without receipts to really show what was done when, a lot is a guess... the most difficult part being the labor involved with the clutch removal which pretty much means we tell you to buy everything at once to assure it doesnt have to come out again!

If possible contact MTI or call the previous owner to see if he for sure bought a new master, slave, clutch and flywheel, and get a receipt for it... Spec generally does not cover anything other then manufacturer defects, but any time ive personally come to them with a true issue they havent denied us.

[Guest Sidewinder]

offering that info right there Mike is why you will always get my business.

thanks

chad

Do you smell clutch burning when it slips?

[Drewstein]

You already know where I live, come by and see if you like the Spec 5. I had to go from the 3+ to the 5 because the 3+ is only rated to 600ish and when Mike pulled it you could tell I put it to it and my new setup would have destroyed it.

P.S. The offer to drive my car doesn't apply to everyone!

[Guest UVETTYA]

You already know where I live, come by and see if you like the Spec 5. I had to go from the 3+ to the 5 because the 3+ is only rated to 600ish and when Mike pulled it you could tell I put it to it and my new setup would have destroyed it.

P.S. The offer to drive my car doesn't apply to everyone!

You TEASE!

[Guest UVETTYA]

I think I had a similar issue with my '03. There were two occassions when I was on the freeway in 6th and down shifted to 5th and punched it and the clutch slipped. But I think I may have been at fault, by unintentionally slipping the clutch by feeding in throttle when I let it out. Other than that it never slipped, and I could still launch hard. So it might not be a problem with your clutch. If it happens again pay attention to how you let the clutch out. You might not really have a problem with the clutch. :D

BTW, have you checked your hydraulic fluid lately? If it's black again, which it probably is, maybe you could try the turkey baster trick. Suck out the old fluid, wipe the reservoir clean and refill with Valvoline SYNPower DOT 3 brake fluid. Do that every few times you drive it until it stays clean.

[ZWOW6]

Do the vettes ever need the drill out mod that the f-bodies needed ? I did it to my Firehawk and never had a issue with my Z06 clutch i had put in. I think I might have smoked my clutch today at SW I wonder if its toast ? It seems to be driving ok, but ??

Tim

[Guest UVETTYA]

Do the vettes ever need the drill out mod that the f-bodies needed ? I did it to my Firehawk and never had a issue with my Z06 clutch i had put in. I think I might have smoked my clutch today at SW I wonder if its toast ? It seems to be driving ok, but ??

Tim

I've heard some have drilled out the orifice and that helps. Technically the problem is the fluid in the slave heats up under hard acceleration, and after a few launches it turns black and creates residue that clogs the orifice, which results in more heating. That's why it's a good idea to change the fluid often, which alleviates the problem all together. You can use the turkey baster trick but that doesn't get it all out. You need to bleed the slave, and that's a PITA. I had Steve at AZP&S install an LAPD clutch bleeder with the new clutch, and that is the way to go. You can't get all the burnt fluid out of the slave with just the turkey baster trick, you have to bleed it. Once you do that and have fresh fluid in the slave, it works just fine.

Don't worry about your clutch if it's working ok now. I've stunk mine up a few times and it worked just fine after that. The clutch surfaces themselves are probably ok, maybe glazed a little. Do a couple of good launches on street tires and it will be fine. Most of the C5 clutch issues are due to the poor design of the hydraulic slave cylinder.

Steve

[ZWOW6]

My problem happened on my 2nd run. I just get any water on the back tire, thought it would spin, and maybe not high enough rpms, when i let the cluch out to clean off the tires....I'll check my fluid. they drill out mod worked well on my firehawk.

thanks for the info

Tim