Playing with my E85 Tune trying to get used to HP Tuners

[Cross]

Sure that would not be a bad idea I think. Thanks

[ChadC]

Do you want to borrow my Greg Banish tuning DVD's? I've got his beginner and advanced DVD's.

if he doesent I do.

shoot me a PM at your leisure.

[Jon]

I can just have him send you the DVD's after he is done watching them. I've also got a pdf of "The Tuning School" material. PM me your email and I will send it.

[Cross]

Done, thank you Jon

[Cross]

Well I have been trying to read through and make progress today but it seems I can not do the MAF STFT Histogram for some reason... no idea why. Trying to get a better understanding of why it says the option is not there once I plug it into the car (HP Tuners) but at this time I have done 3 more data logs and I am running a very sim Corvette's MAF table. I have not done anything to the VE as I still am not sure just how to ensure I have that right...

Its making a lot of fuel adjustments though. I am going to the Dyno night here in Tucson to see if the changes made any difference. I would love to hear from Nic what the normal Timing WOT he runs is for E85 and if any of his clients would consider sharing information and tunes so I can further work on mine with someone actually running E85. If not I completely understand but I would love to get a target area for timing that he normally see's and his thoughts on my current table.

First Log Today

Second Log Today (Highway run)

Third Log Today

[Two Fangs]

Be extremely careful borrowing VE and MAF files from the repository. Depending on whether the tune was scaled, and the VE of the engine the tune was made for, this can have very bad results.

[Cross]

I didn't change the VE table.. I would like to but I need more time reading up on how it affects everything. The MAF Table I have been logging and working with to change on my own. I did a little work tonight on that following the guide I posted a link to here from the HP Tuners forum. Dyno'd on a Mustang Dyno 373/373. Got a lot of good information and explanation on where things are etc and made some changes to the tune afterwards. Still the fuel trims are not right at all its correcting them quite a bit but the car really feel's solid. I guess according to what I read dynojet vs mustang dyno is a 12% difference or so so that means I am doing a decent job. With some further understanding and hopefully a few more questions answered if Nic can jump in I should be able to have a decent tune until I can afford to come up and see him after christmas. I will upload the current tune settings and logs from the dyno to see what you guys think if you want to take a look. It was a fun night at ES Tuned some really nice numbers put down.

[NicD]

Personally I run E85 rich at WOT, as with all alcohol fuels this can help build torque earlier and keep it the whole way through the powerband. Leaning out E85 is unnecessary and often counter productive for making power. I can't say what amount of timing I would run on your combo without actually being there and doing it myself but what you had in the tune before was pretty high in my opinion even for E85. The first things you need to do is to redo your VE table and MAF table as they are way off. There are beginners guides all over the internet that explain the basics of this. Just keep in mind that without real injector data or a way to back calculate the offsets you are baking in errors all over the place in your data. Parker is also right about borrowing files from the repository. Most of them are flat out wrong and you don't want to start with somebody else's anyways.

[Cross]

Alright I have been working on the Maf tuning, as for the VE table thats next for changes. While at the dyno day another local tuner was helping me with understanding some of the area's I could look into, where to make changes and what I was working with.

This is the tune as it stands now:

Current Tune

I am going to keep playing obviously as I have been, I believe (They did not do AFR since it was a dyno day event) that the enrichment's had it at almost 7.4 on the dyno run. I would like 8.3-8.4 from my understanding so I made adjustments there.

I have a few data logs on it, I will lower the timing some and see what it does it wasn't knocking anywhere expect early on at low RPM's which I blamed on the roller rockers/loud lifter I seem to have. Seems its time for the LS7 Lifters and to pull the heads... I can't say I am looking forward to that but oh well. However I am almost positive thats why I had no knock on WOT but knocked at low RPM's as thats when I could hear that tick that always seems to come and go. Or I could be dead wrong.

I def. appreciate the help Nic, I want to come see you but like I said now is not the time for me to spend more money until I have my son back and that situation handled. Until then I have to much coming up to jump into more with the car. But soon I hope to be able to and I will go after Ford 42's, you taking a look at the tune and some LS7 lifters.

[Cross]

So its a small victory but after making a few more changes and listening to Nic D's advice I decided I was annoyed with cold starts taking two times to start so I went nuts editing the startup setup and now every time first try cold or not she fires right up right that second. It really wasn't bad before just on cold starts it would take the second try but well... I needed to get somewhere with some of it lol. I feel like I make progress in some area's but in others not so much.

[FNBADAZ06]

So its a small victory but after making a few more changes and listening to Nic D's advice I decided I was annoyed with cold starts taking two times to start so I went nuts editing the startup setup and now every time first try cold or not she fires right up right that second. It really wasn't bad before just on cold starts it would take the second try but well... I needed to get somewhere with some of it lol.

I feel like I make progress in some area's but in others not so much.

Good to hear you're making progress

[Cross]

Alright, after today I devoted my time to working in the garage and working on the tune (And an interview with the Amphi School District, #2 in fact keeping my fingers crossed). I am about to go give it a shot I think I might have made some good progress on the VE and MAF tables... or I completely screwed up one or the other.

With the Idle its hit or miss it locks in quickly but it still hunts and occasionally it really hunts but it seems to settle quickly. I will keep working on it I am close... I think lol.

Data Log #1 11.15

Data Log #2 11.15

Current Tune 11.15

--Side Note--

So it seems now I am Bad Mouthing the tuner of my car and people are telling him about it. How about this, if someone feels I am bad mouthing the person who I paid 450.00 (plus 130 dyno tune time) to tune my car they can have the decency to come in here and say it. I have stayed as neutral as I can given the comments and feedback I have gotten. I am sad to hear this is the result of someone else's childish internet drama.

Hopefully it ends.

[Cross]

I can tell you right now if I say a word I will be told I am an idiot, I don't know anything, and I will most likely get a lot of crap from the locals esp. on DSC (If I did not get banned, just posting this thread here may be enough to cause problems, thats why I have been so careful in how I worded it I am trying not to cause issues). Whats sad is not including dyno time (130 for that) I have like 450 in this tune.

I think as long as you keep it respectful and not sling any, I don't see where anyone at DSC can fault you for asking some basic questions regarding your tune.

Hunter post on hear on occassion and shouldn't have an issue with you contacting and asking questions of the tuner. Maybe the tuners at the dyno event coming this weekend in Tucson might be able to help....I saw where Hunter was trying to be as accomadating to your schedule as possible

You've got legit questions for the tuner....go ask him !!!

Remember how I said me saying anything would go badly well it got back to him about this thread and was of course my fault. This started last night and as you can see I posted above disappointed I was dragged into a mess because I wanted to change things.

No matter what was sent (I sent a email to Mike) its my fault and as said its started a "Your a jerk, this is why no one likes you" among other things that I thought was corrected until 5:48am when I get another text from him and it wakes me up because I think its about my Son instead its about this. So excuse me for late posting but well I can not get back to sleep now.

So this thread alone has created a whole side story of me bashing the tuner supposedly and caused an issue nothing regarding the tune etc.

[Jon]

People suck. It's that simple. Don't let it bother you that much. You will always have to deal with some form of nut swingers. F 'em.

[Cross]

Oh and supposedly he contacted Nic D and warned Nic about me, so Nic will supposedly not be deal with me according to him. His words I saved all the text messages.

[Ted Y]

Is your tuner Mike O'Connor from the former Arizona Power and Sound?

[NicD]

Jesus, leave me out of this. I've given my thoughts on the tune and what is wrong with it is indisputable and this is why I don't bother to give much advice online anymore because people take it wrong or personally. I've got no problems with Mike and have known him for a long time but this tune has problems and that's as much as I'm going to go into it. If you need them fixed in the future I can still tune the car but that's it.

[FNBADAZ06]

People suck. It's that simple. Don't let it bother you that much. You will always have to deal with some form of nut swingers. F 'em.

[FNBADAZ06]

Jesus, leave me out of this. I've given my thoughts on the tune and what is wrong with it is indisputable and this is why I don't bother to give much advice online anymore because people take it wrong or personally. I've got no problems with Mike and have known him for a long time but this tune has problems and that's as much as I'm going to go into it. If you need them fixed in the future I can still tune the car but that's it.

Nic, I hope this doesn't sway you from giving advise on THIS board, as it's very much appreciated here :

Your insight into the complicated tuning world is truly amazing, as is M. Parker's, and we here at ACE are very lucky to have you both on board.

Mixing tuners into a tune is just as bad as mixing competitive software developers into a single project.

It's unfortunate that CROSS find's himself in this situation....don't let it influence your decisions to participate here.

[FNBADAZ06]

Oh and supposedly he contacted Nic D and warned Nic about me, so Nic will supposedly not be deal with me according to him.

His words I saved all the text messages.

CROSS....might I suggest that in sensitive cases like this, you might want to consider leaving "name drops" out of the thread, and use PM's instead if the there is a need to disclose this type of information...just my .02

[NicD]

No worries, I'll still give out advice but I just don't like being used by both sides with things twisted to suit their argument or view. I've been drug into it with the "he said but he said" and I don't play that game.

[FNBADAZ06]

No worries, I'll still give out advice but I just don't like being used by both sides with things twisted to suit their argument or view. I've been drug into it with the "he said but he said" and I don't play that game.

I hear ya.....the "name drop" stuff sucks, and so does personal drama in a tech board.

[Two Fangs]

I hear ya.....the "name drop" stuff sucks, and so does personal drama in a tech board.

I take it you've never been over at Yellow Bullet?

[FNBADAZ06]

I hear ya.....the "name drop" stuff sucks, and so does personal drama in a tech board.

I take it you've never been over at Yellow Bullet?

Oh yeah I have.....I only lurk there, though

Drama, drama, drama....it happens on all the boards, regardless of age bracket too

[Cross]

Jesus, leave me out of this. I've given my thoughts on the tune and what is wrong with it is indisputable and this is why I don't bother to give much advice online anymore because people take it wrong or personally. I've got no problems with Mike and have known him for a long time but this tune has problems and that's as much as I'm going to go into it. If you need them fixed in the future I can still tune the car but that's it.

I honestly was not attempting too, It was taken upon the tuner to tell me you would not deal with me and how he had told you all about me. I personally did not know there was an issue and I mentioned it because honestly I was very surprised to have that come back to me.

Nic, I hope this doesn't sway you from giving advise on THIS board, as it's very much appreciated here :

Your insight into the complicated tuning world is truly amazing, as is M. Parker's, and we here at ACE are very lucky to have you both on board.

Mixing tuners into a tune is just as bad as mixing competitive software developers into a single project.

It's unfortunate that CROSS find's himself in this situation....don't let it influence your decisions to participate here.

I am not sure what your implying here, I did not mix tuners or even talk to Mike about this tune once I started making changes until he came to me saying I was bad mouthing him. Even when you suggested I start it I declined because I saw it would just cause a problem. I went out of my way to try and not be derogatory towards Mike, I paid him I never contacted him pissed off because as I said before it would cause a problem and I did not want that. I just moved forward on working on the tune myself until I could afford Nic's time.

I would hope you know that its not my intention to see you not help others or feel I was trying to cause you a problem. If you would like I am happy to speak with you privately. (Nic)

Either way though all I wanted was to make changes to my tune that he did not agree with, I asked for help here and I did not say I did not like his work just that I have my own idea's. Little did I know what I would find when others looked at it, its obvious I had not looked that closely as I trusted the tuner. I am sorry it has caused any discomfort.